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Leah Segedie on the Fact About PFAS and Easy methods to (Considerably) Keep away from Them

Leah Segedie on the Fact About PFAS and Easy methods to (Considerably) Keep away from Them

Leah Segedie on the Truth about PFAS and How to (Somewhat) Avoid Them

Little one: Welcome to my Mommy’s podcast.


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Katie: Hiya, and welcome to the wellness mama podcast. I’m Katie from and That’s wellness with an E on the tip. And I’m right here right this moment with Leah Segedie, who helps girls and mothers make safer shopper selections for his or her households. And he or she is the creator at And on this episode, we speak particularly about one thing known as PFAS, that are chemical substances which can be present in every kind of family merchandise. We go deep on this right this moment, however we speak about what they’re, why they’re thought-about endlessly chemical substances, how there are over 10,000 within the setting, and the way they have an effect on the physique in numerous alternative ways. We speak about how testing could be very nuanced, and the way even pure and natural merchandise can have traces of those chemical substances, learn how to keep away from them with out going loopy and a lot extra, very, very fact-packed episode. I do know I realized loads. I hope you’ll too. So let’s be part of Leah. Leah, welcome again. How are you?


Leah: Hey, thanks for having me on Katie, so good to see you once more too. I by no means get to see you.


Katie: Likewise, I really like that we do video now. For anyone listening who didn’t know, there’s video on YouTube that you simply guys can really watch our faces whereas we speak. I believe most individuals nonetheless hear on podcast apps, however it’s enjoyable to get to see your face. Really feel prefer it makes it extra private. And such as you stated, it’s been some time since we acquired to catch up. And we’re going to get to catch up in-depth on a really explicit problem. However earlier than we do, I’ve a be aware in my present notes that you’ve hip dysplasia and are mainly a human pretzel. So I’d simply love to listen to somewhat bit about this story first.


Leah: Okay, so there’s a genetic hip situation in my household. I’ve it, my mom has it. We don’t know additional than that as a result of my mom is adopted, however it’s hip dysplasia. Now, most individuals have heard of hip dysplasia as a result of they’ve a canine. And that canine has hip dysplasia, and it’s somewhat wiener canine or one thing. And so the those who have heard about it are like, “Sure, my canine has that.” And no, I’m not a canine. However sure, that illness does occur in people. However there’s two varieties of those who it’s actually frequent in, Native American Cherokee Indian, and the Sami, who’re in Norway, Finland, and Sweden, they usually’re the reindeer individuals. And I completely come from a Nordic, so it’s completely coming from the Sami. They usually have a lot of it, it’s been written up in Nationwide Geographic and stuff, so you’ll be able to Google it. However mainly, what it means is my hips come out of the socket, there’s about this a lot room in my socket that’s simply open. So I can simply pop it out of socket each time I need.


Now, once I’m operating, that’s dangerous, as a result of it doesn’t really feel good. However the cool factor is, it makes me very limber. Should you can think about me being pregnant, like 9 months pregnant, and with the ability to put my foot again right here once I’m stretching. Like private trainers freak out after they see this proper? And it’s completely cool for me. So I’m very versatile and I could make myself a pretzel by placing each of my ft right here. But when I do it, if I get the second up, I simply go ahead, so the one place I wish to do it’s within the mattress. As a result of , I don’t have the…I simply appear to be a humorous toy once I do this. However it is extremely attention-grabbing and humorous to speak about. However sure, I can put my ft proper again right here and like a human pretzel. Completely.


Katie: That’s humorous. And one among my…


Leah: If nobody has recognized me then now they’re simply gonna know that I’m Leah Segedie, the human pretzel, which I discover wonderful.


Katie: Properly, and one among my favourite journey reminiscences of all time was really visiting northern Finland and getting to satisfy the Sami tribe. They’re among the most fascinating individuals I’ve ever met and completely stunning the way in which their life-style is, very completely different than mine in a really heat local weather. And it was so, so cool to see. In order that’s cool and you’ve got a tie to them as effectively.


Leah: Yeah, I’ve a tie them after which…however I’ve extra of my family members that I do know which can be in Sweden, however they’re extra within the metropolis now. And Bergen, Norway too, I’ve numerous family members which can be in Bergen, which is admittedly cool to go to as a result of the fjords are simply wonderful. It’s important to go there as soon as in your lifetime.


Katie: I’ll put it on the record. And I really feel like I might speak about that each one day lengthy. However we even have one other necessary matter that I believe can be actually related to lots of people listening, even when they don’t notice it’s going to be so related to them. And I do know that you’ve been doing a brilliant, tremendous, tremendous deep dive into this matter, which is why I used to be so excited to speak to you about them right this moment. So I’d say let’s begin actually, actually broad and simply outline the important thing time period that we’re going to speak loads about right this moment, which is I hope I pronounced it proper, PFAS?


Leah: It’s known as, you’ll be able to seek advice from it as PFAS or PFAS. However PFAS might be what you’re going to listen to most individuals say P-F-A-S, so it’s simply an abbreviation they usually’re simply placing it collectively. So primarily, once we’re speaking about PFAS, we’re speaking about over ten thousand chemical substances and a chemical class. They usually all have fluorine and carbon in them of their bond. However you’ve heard of those chemical substances as a result of it’s all of the stain-resistant, waterproof, grease-proof chemical substances that now we have been form of swimming in for many years. Now, these chemical substances was once regarded as protected, , inert, like okay, however within the final couple a long time, we discovered that they’re persistent, which implies they don’t go away. Scientists don’t even know what the half-life of those chemical substances are. That’s why they’re known as endlessly chemical substances. These endlessly chemical substances can final in your physique for a few years or a long time. They simply actually don’t know the extent of all of it and why as a result of there’s 10,000 of them and the unbiased scientists who have been coming within the backend attempting to see in the event that they’re protected, it’s been loads and lot numerous dangerous information. So in case you’ve heard about carpet not having PFAS in it anymore, or clothes firms popping out and, , engaged on PFAS options, or when you have thrown out your Teflon cookware, that’s one other instance. These are all examples of PFAS chemical substances that now we have had in our lives for many years. And now we perceive how extremely problematic they’re.


So what I’m doing proper now’s, and thru Mamavation, is admittedly attempting to construct up some consciousness round girls, in order that they know what to search for and know learn how to keep away from them. And the toughest a part of this example is it’s inconceivable to utterly keep away from them. You would need to dwell…you couldn’t even go to, I imply, Iceland, or the place the polar bears are, you’d nonetheless discover them there. So that you actually can’t keep away from them. That’s as a result of they’re persistent, they usually get all over the place. However what we are able to do is we are able to make educated selections and selections in our house, and decrease the quantity that we’re uncovered to, and most of all our kids are uncovered to as a result of that’s the place that is actually, actually necessary is the subsequent technology.


Katie: Yeah, I do know, we’re very aligned on that, and the significance of, in lots of areas, enhancing issues for our children. What are among the problematic areas we see with regards to these and well being? I do know, like, we’re nonetheless doing analysis on this and, such as you stated, numerous this analysis is barely within the final couple of a long time. However what do we all know so far as how this impacts human well being?


Leah: So to begin with, it’s an androgen mimicker. So it goes into your physique and your physique really thinks it’s a hormone for males. It thinks it’s testosterone, so it thinks it’s androgen. So for boys, little boys and males, that is worse than for women, it’s actually dangerous for women, however it’s worse for males. So simply give it some thought by way of that, you don’t want additional testosterone in your physique. However in case you’re a person, and also you get additional testosterone in your physique, your physique says, “Okay, performed, I’ve produced sufficient.” And so for a person, it brings down your testosterone, which is one thing that’s actually dangerous in case you’re attempting to have a child, otherwise you’re attempting to breed, . The opposite factor that it does, it’s actually problematic, that’s linked with the whole lot else is it kills your immune system, primarily, it brings down your immunity so that you simply can’t struggle off illnesses.


Now, right here’s an instance of one thing of how that is occurring. Now, I don’t understand how many individuals are professional or anti-vaccine or no matter. However what I’ll say, and that is very, very, very sound science, that the extra PFAS you could have in your system, the much less seemingly vaccinations will work inside your physique as a result of it’s bringing down your immune system, your physique simply can’t do it. In order that’s among the stuff that they’re discovering, oh, inside the final three, 4 years is that they’re infants, and the way infants reply. And I don’t know in the event that they’ve performed this in adults, however they’ve undoubtedly performed in youngsters. They usually know that the extra you could have in your physique, and bear in mind, this will occur in utero since you’re pregnant, the much less seemingly you’ll be able to reply to one thing like a vaccine, or every other kind of remedy that’s like that, that’s alleged to carry up your immune system. In order that’s one factor you actually wish to watch out about.


They’re additionally linking it to metabolism points and sort 2 diabetes. In order that they’re linking it to kind 2 diabetes, particularly in girls. So there’s numerous girls strolling round who’re having points and it might have one thing to do with the quantity of PFAS that they’ve of their system. After which, after all, cancers, there’s numerous cancers that is linked to, like prostate most cancers and people sorts of issues, which is sensible in case you notice it really works like an artificial androgen in your physique. In order that’s form of the totality of it. The issue that we’re actually, actually coping with is, , what’s occurring to us can be occurring to the earth. It’s persistent on the market, it’s getting within the soil, it’s getting within the groundwater, it’s getting in our shopper merchandise, it’s getting in all types of issues.


And so to be conscious that that is on the market, however not petrified, proper, since you don’t wish to stress your self out to the quantity that you simply’re making your self sick, proper? However on this planet of, these are chemical substances that I wish to keep away from, this can be a 10, and this is sort of a 3, PFAS is increased up there, it’s extra of an 8, 9, or 10 is what I’d take a look at first earlier than you determine some…I don’t know, in case you’re frightened about one thing like sodium benzoate in your shampoo versus PFAS in one thing, don’t even fear in regards to the sodium benzoate. You realize what I imply? Like, these varieties of issues. That’s an even bigger class that you simply simply wish to keep away from.


Katie: Yeah. So many necessary factors I believe you’ve simply made. And I believe what I’d simply spotlight is whether or not individuals are in favor of vaccines or they’re not, I believe that’s its personal separate dialog, however the necessary similarity there’s that in each circumstances, whether or not you’re speaking pure immunity or vaccine immunity, you want a functioning immune system to create that impact. And so I really feel like that’s really a commonality. It’s really easy for that to turn into a polarizing problem. However in each circumstances, it’s like how can we assist the immune system in pure methods in both of these circumstances, and that’s one thing we are able to really all agree on. And so this can be a piece of that puzzle. I consider numerous similarities like plastic-type chemical substances, as an illustration, as effectively, these are very problematic, they’ve now saturated the planet, they’re storing in our our bodies, which additionally brings up the query, how if doable in any respect can we get these out of our physique as soon as we’ve been uncovered?


Leah: You’ll be able to’t. Properly, right here’s the laborious factor, it builds up. So it’s a kind of chemical substances that we don’t have any proof of something with the ability to take it out of our physique. That’s the laborious half. Proper? And that’s absolutely the reality. If individuals inform you the other, I don’t understand how supported that’s by the info, proper? So that is a kind of distinctive chemical substances that doesn’t function like different chemical substances, , numerous these nasty, persistent chemical substances are trapped in fats. So in case you can pull it out by way of the fats, then you’ll be able to pull it out of the physique, that is repelled by fats. So it simply actually operates very in a different way in your physique, and the reply is they only don’t know.


So what the best-case state of affairs is correct now’s to keep away from it as a lot as you’ll be able to, select merchandise that don’t have it, be very cautious of it while you’re pregnant, after which when your youngsters are about 5, and so up till that, that’s while you’re simply , on the lookout for it, avoiding it. After that, you don’t need it, however after all, , hormone-disrupting chemical substances are worse throughout hormone modifications through the physique. So the worst time is prenatal. In order that’s when the whole lot is altering and it right down to the second, the minute, , issues acquired to simply align proper. The second half is while you’re out and it’s 5 years, , your physique has like pure defenses it builds up doesn’t actually have that till you’re over 5.


Now, the third time in your life, for ladies particularly, and for males, is while you undergo the change, proper, you begin to turn into a lady otherwise you turn into a person, that’s a time when, as a mom, you wish to begin to consider this, though they don’t care, you continue to wish to give it some thought, proper? After which in direction of the tip of your life, for ladies it’s while you undergo the change once more and also you cease with the ability to, , have a child. And for males, I don’t know when males undergo, , that change, somebody ought to inform me, however I’ve three boys, it will be good to know, really. However these are a very powerful occasions so that you can begin serious about these items, when these varieties of individuals… when you could have youngsters in the home.


Katie: Yeah, and I believe the stability, such as you stated is necessary, like keep away from it each time doable, however to not the purpose that it’s inflicting stress, which we additionally know is extraordinarily dangerous to well being. After which from there, I all the time consider, particularly once we’re speaking about chemical substances, we don’t really know learn how to get out of the physique. It’s like assist the pure detox pathways in any approach doable. After which attempt to preserve a balanced stress degree and never be stressing about it past that. So I’m a giant fan of issues like sauna, simply fundamental hydration, consuming meals like inexperienced leafy greens that bind to extra phytoestrogens and different chemical substances within the physique.


Leah: And poop, proper? As a result of all of the dangerous stuff comes out while you poop, you wish to do this, proper? I’m speaking about poop and this, poop and PFAS is hilarious. However we don’t know if it comes…I imply, we simply…, they haven’t performed research on that but. However I believe it’s as a result of they’re so overwhelmed proper now attempting to determine the ins and the outs of all these chemical substances. You have been saying one thing about plasticizers. Sarcastically, it’s additionally a plasticizer. As a result of there’s a complete class known as PTFE, which is on these Teflon pans, which is form of like, which is a polymer. And mockingly, , once I do testing, there aren’t any exams to search out all of those polymers. So once I’m testing for these chemical substances, and I’m on the lookout for over 10,000 of them, the form of testing that I’m working is extra of a spot verify. It’s trying to see if these chemical parts are there, it’s not telling you what particular PFAS it’s as a result of it’s inconceivable. There’s solely about 90 chemical substances you’ll be able to check for at a extremely good industrial lab. Most of those labs that you could check for will solely have the ability to check for perhaps 16 to 30. But it surely’s in a college lab, they will most likely discover about 150, however that’s it for compound testing and discovering out precisely what it’s.


The opposite choice is what you see numerous NGOs doing and us doing is we search for fluorine in any product, proper? And so you then function one other check that pulls out the fluoride from the fluorine, which is the pure and leaves the artifical, and we search for one thing known as natural fluorine, which isn’t a beautiful factor. After I say natural by way of chemistry, it doesn’t imply the natural requirements. No, it form of means the other, it means man-made. So I’m on the lookout for the man-made fluorine. If you discover that, there’s form of solely two choices. One is PFAS, which it’s very more likely to be, the opposite one is fluorinated prescription drugs as a result of 25% of pharmaceutical merchandise are all fluorinated, so these are the 2 issues that I may very well be discovering. The testing that I function is a extremely excessive check. It seems to be at 10 elements per million. Now, though I’m saying elements per million, and that’s actually tiny, it’s really a bigger quantity as a result of after they’re testing in water, they’re trying all the way in which down within the elements per trillion, which is sort of a drop in three Olympic dimension swimming pools, proper? And so mine could be perhaps a drop in an everyday pool or one thing like that, proper? So we’re far bigger, and we’re not trying in water, we’re trying in shopper merchandise, like private care, something that may be burned, primarily, as a result of that’s how the check is, burns issues, . So if it may possibly’t be burned, we are able to’t use that testing methodology. Then there’s different issues we are able to take a look at.


But it surely’s additionally actually tough to search out, and , the devils within the particulars, in case you can’t discover it and isolate it, then can they regulate it? I don’t know. In order that’s the place I really feel like I’m form of standing within the center right here. I’m sending numerous merchandise off to the lab and I’m beginning with merchandise that we’d buy that will be pure, , sending these off first as a affirmation as a result of my viewers desires to know in regards to the issues that they’re already buying first, after which they wish to find out about the whole lot else. And you’d be form of stunned, within the pure business, how a lot of this chemical we’re going to search out. There’s numerous causes behind that.


One of many causes is, like as an illustration, in case you’re shopping for natural meals, there’s nothing within the natural requirements to stop them from utilizing FDA-approved components in manufacturing. They usually don’t have any requirements behind that, and I simply confirmed that once more final week as a result of I used to be, , emailing them, I’m like, “Oh, I can’t discover something within the requirements.” They usually’re like, “It’s not there.” They usually’ll say to me one thing like, “Properly, it’s best to, , strain the FDA to take these out of…, as authorized oblique components, as an alternative of coming down on us.” And I’m like, “I believe it’s best to most likely repair this within the requirements, I simply suppose it’s best to.” However that’s simply my opinion.


So it may be in something, primarily. And in case you check out the FDA web site, on what’s authorized for a meals contact kind of substance, there’s numerous polymers which can be authorized, polymeric PFAS. So which means these are PFAS chemical substances which can be made up of all these several types of monomers. So it’s prefer it’s a PFAS fabricated from PFAS, and likewise, however it turns into like a plastic, proper? So we’re going to see this, most likely, I’m considering, since there’s so a lot of them which can be authorized by the FDA, that’s most likely what we’d most likely be seeing in meals, , kind of producing. I’ve by no means been capable of isolate and discover it as a result of these exams are simply not accessible. However I preserve seeing it in every kind of merchandise. And I’m actually joyful to do that testing as a result of not solely do I wish to know, however as soon as I began testing, all people else wished to know as effectively. So it’s an ideal service that we’re capable of present for individuals at Mamavation. I’m actually joyful to have the ability to do that.


Katie: I’m going to go line by line with some frequent merchandise and like, undergo what you discovered on the testing. However earlier than we get into the extra detailed half, I’d love to listen to what are among the frequent sources within the house setting that some individuals listening…particularly lots of people listening are already extra naturally minded, like your viewers as effectively. What could be among the frequent sources and the way can we begin to keep away from it within the house?


Leah: So the primary place goes to be you’re going to eat it and drink it, that’s the place they nonetheless suppose you’re getting the overwhelming majority of that is. A number of this could be cookware, so when you have Teflon-based cookware or nonstick cookware in any respect, I’d keep away from that. Clearly, I do know you’ve acquired nice content material about that and I’ve acquired content material about that, that have been form of shoving you guys off of nano-based cookware and nonstick cookware. In order that’s one place. You additionally wish to search for it in your small kitchen home equipment, as a result of you will see it in issues like air fryers, you’ll discover it in issues like toasters, and it’s not on the meals contact floor, it’s exterior. And the loopy factor about that’s if it’s on the partitions on the surface, if it will get too scorching, it may possibly disperse into that air so it’s nonetheless form of a difficulty. So we’re proper now working by way of these merchandise for air fryers and every kind of various issues. I’d simply say name up the corporate, look and double-check to make it possible for they’re not including something to those merchandise on the surfaces. Positively not meals contact, meals contact could be the primary half, however that’s what I search for.


Meals packaging is one other problem, issues that we don’t consider like parchment paper. I discovered it in parchment paper. So there are some parchment papers which can be fabricated from silicone and there’s some parchment papers which can be fabricated from PFAS. They usually, a few of them generally they’ll inform you, however you bought to be trying to see which of them, and simply to form of assist out your individuals proper now as a result of I do know that you simply’re going to ask me which of them are protected. If You Care, we examined that particular model, it’s the brown wrapper that appears form of recycled, that one we didn’t discover something in. One other Finnish firm, which is known as Gifbera, after which one other one known as Katbite, which I believe is Korean, these are all accessible on Amazon. So If You Care, Gifbera, Katbite, these we examined, and we didn’t discover something, however we did discover it in Reynolds. And we did discover it in Kirkland, so Costco. So these are meals packaging.


However right here’s like, numerous occasions while you’re going to get this in your meals packaging, it’s going to be extra of a difficulty of I went out to eat, or I’m utilizing one thing that’s processed. So the reply is the extra you’ll be able to cook dinner from scratch at house, the extra you’re going to have the ability to eliminate these contaminants with out even realizing about it as a result of numerous occasions it has to do with the processing of the meals in some way, and the way these chemical substances, be in polymers or no matter, are stepping into the whole lot. So the extra you’ll be able to cook dinner by yourself…once more, I believe that’s most likely one thing that you simply love to listen to, the extra you’ll be able to cook dinner utilizing elements that about, the higher off you might be.


One other actually massive space is family mud. This isn’t one thing that you’d take into consideration. However , your mud is then analyzed. Your family mud has been analyzed at a lab, not yours particularly, however different individuals’s. And it comprises numerous hearth retardants, phthalates, and PFAS. And that’s coming off of your electrical gear in your own home. So your tv most likely has some PFAS within the wiring, perhaps has it someplace. And when that plastic will get scorching, numerous these plastics have hearth retardants and different varieties of issues inside them. Now, over time, and I imply, over years, because it will get scorching, they form of emit into the air, and these particles are extremely magnetized in direction of mud. In order that they persist with the mud they usually fall, proper?


So how do you get this out of your own home? I’d say simply mud, I hate that reply however that’s actually the reply. The extra you mud, , the cleaner you retain your own home, the much less seemingly your youngsters are going to be uncovered to this. Now, I can’t cease them from like, , being on carpet in case you could have previous carpeting with PFAS on it, there’s nothing I can do for that different than simply vacuum a ton, , to get that stuff out of it, it should break down over time and be launched. So vacuum as a lot as you’ll be able to, these varieties of issues. Get an air air purifier, among the finest air purifiers are on the market. Although I do know those that we advocate are most likely additionally going to be pulling in PFAS as a result of in the event that they’re pulling within the mud, that’s the place it’s, proper? So that you wish to eliminate the mud.


Make-up and private care, this can be a actually tough problem. Earlier this yr, they did an investigation not me, however the precise scientists, proper? And they also checked out over 300 typical, largely typical make-up merchandise they usually discovered it overwhelmingly in make-up, give it some thought like this, stays longer, waterproof, what I’m saying? You need your make-up to remain in your face and never go wherever and the extra we’ve demanded that the extra they put in PFAS. So that you wish to form of search for issues that don’t have any claims about long-lasting, don’t have any claims about being waterproof.


I’d say we discovered about six or seven completely different manufacturers of make-up within the pure world that I didn’t discover, , any natural fluorine on the ranges we’re on the lookout for. However most of even the pure magnificence merchandise, , make-up manufacturers, it’s like…like, I used to be numerous issues, mascara and lip gloss so to talk as a result of I knew that these are like what everybody’s utilizing day by day, proper, lip gloss, after which if it’s basis, it’s like next-level dedication, proper? So we simply went within the first go dedication, and in some manufacturers, we discovered it not of their mascara however discovered of their lip gloss or vice versa. So it was actually tough to form of have the ability to say this model or that model as a result of we needed to do numerous testing to determine that out. So make-up I’d say, and different than simply, , following me and what I’m testing there’s no different reply to make-up as a result of nobody’s placing that data on the market. Even the scientists who have been it, they’re probably not like granting you the uncooked knowledge to have the ability to work out which one they examined however that’s why we did it.


One other factor is like water, look into your water. This can be a actually massive deal as a result of in case you dwell by a navy base otherwise you dwell by an airport that is actually necessary, navy bases and airports have been utilizing firefighting foam to place out grease fires which have PFAS in them and it has seeped into the groundwater beneath and has contaminated numerous groundwater by these bases. So in case you dwell by an airport otherwise you dwell by a navy base, I’d simply exit and get a water air purifier regardless, don’t even wait. As a result of the reply is it’s most likely going to be there and it is probably not a kind of PFAS that we are able to acknowledge simply but. You realize, as a result of that’s the opposite drawback with water is, we aren’t as much as testing in any respect. So I’d simply assume, , that that’s how I’m working proper now’s I’m simply assuming, though our water system doesn’t have something in it, it’s like, yeah, you solely examined 16 of them, , there’s like 10,000 on the market, , that’s how I really feel like there’s a giant gaping gap. So water, work on water.


Clothes is one other massive one, however the reply to clothes is we don’t know the reply behind dermal contact. So I’ve numerous advisors who work on this and a few of them are working behind the scenes to growing strategies for testing. A few of them, , they’re working at several types of phases in several types of methods with this chemical. However the one factor that all of them agreed on was we don’t know sufficient about dermal contact. We don’t know if one thing rubs up towards your pores and skin, and it’s a PFAS chemical, will it get in? How will it get in? How a lot we’ll get in? We don’t know.


And since we don’t know, we are able to’t make any statements about that. So the reply is we don’t know. However the place are you going to search out it? Something that’s stain proof, keep away from issues which can be stain proof, completely 100% as a result of that’s the place it’s going to be. It’s in numerous jackets waterproof. We did an investigation on jackets, so in case you go to Mamavation…I want I might inform you each single one, however it’s very complicated on the market proper now to search out out what’s PFAS-free, after which what’s just a bit part of PFAS-free. A few of these firms which can be producing clothes, aren’t trying on the massive chemical class. They’re solely this over right here, they usually say, “We’re freed from PFC.,” however they’re forgetting all this different stuff over right here, .


And there’s some certifications like Bluesign, as an illustration. Bluesign licensed is a kind of certifications that may enable sure varieties of PFAS chemical substances within the certification and but they form of make a declare that they’re PFAS-free. So it’s complicated for the patron and the explanation it’s complicated for the patron is the scientists have simply form of gotten on the identical web page about the place this chemical is and what we’re going to think about as a part of the chemical. So I don’t wish to say it’s all the companies’ faults, I’m saying that they’re doing what’s within the legislation, , after they’re making these statements, however the statements are altering as a result of the science is altering. And because the science is altering generally the businesses are two, three years behind, , the mantra, the way it’s described. And so I’m operating into numerous that with jackets, like play couches, play modular couches, , something like that, that may have like a stain-proofing about it. So simply be searching for that.


Tents and out of doors gear. Oh, gosh, I can’t…my cousins in Norway are going to snort at me, however there’s one model that we love a lot. And it’s acquired a J in it, I’ll put it in your notes, your present notes. It’s like a Swedish identify and I can’t pronounce it as a result of I don’t communicate Swedish. And it’s acquired a J in it and I’m gonna simply completely butcher it. However there’s numerous European manufacturers that as an alternative of utilizing PFAS, like on their tents, as an illustration, they use beeswax and paraffin proprietarily put collectively and it does a really related or just about the identical factor. These merchandise are extra expensive, , you’re not going to discover a low cost tent that’s PFAS-free with, , extra pure…and I do know paraffin just isn’t pure, however like, , it’s higher than PFAS. These varieties of mixtures which can be much less problematic to the setting in a cheap approach but, hopefully the longer term will change that.


Then additionally, , it’s in automotive wax and surfboard wax, these varieties of issues, and carpet and flooring. We did a bamboo investigation, we checked out a bunch of various bamboo floorings and we solely discovered one which didn’t have detections out of like eight or 9. So I’ve been serious about this by way of what’s round us. You realize, in case you’re going to be doing flooring, as an illustration, , we went after bamboo and we regarded particularly at bamboo as a result of why? I’m like, it’s inexpensive, it doesn’t dent, you’ll be able to stroll round together with your heels and so I used to be attempting to love, , remedy all the issues after which we did discover one model. But it surely’s tough. It’s actually tough to keep away from it, , grandstand overarching, eat out much less, mud extra, and cook dinner from scratch as a lot as you’ll be able to. These are the three issues that I’d say would most likely do probably the most bang on your buck and simply look out for locations who…like in case you go to, we’ve performed an investigation on like numerous issues, not the whole lot but, however on numerous issues. And that’s the…I’m attempting to reply that query, the place is it, how do I keep away from it? And I’m form of going class by class to determine it out as a result of each class is admittedly difficult.


Katie: Yeah, that jogs my memory, within the labeling, like, we began…such as you stated, we’re seeing some which can be labeled as “freed from” sure ones of those, however it jogs my memory of when BPA grew to become well-known, after which it was like BPA-free. However these all had BPS or BPAF or different ones, that are as problematic, the place we’re now discovering, in some circumstances, worse. And so simply because there are some that label now doesn’t essentially imply, such as you stated, that they’re protected.


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And I do know out of your website, you’ve performed investigations into all of those several types of issues. And also you gave us a family overview simply now. However I’d like to undergo some others which can be particularly most likely relevant to mothers. So I cringe to ask, however the first being, what about, like, athletic put on like yoga pants?


Leah: So yoga pants wasn’t as dangerous, really. In order that was one of many higher ones. We examined about, I believe, 32 or 33, completely different yoga pants, athletic put on as a result of that was a query I had. I’m like yoga pants, what I imply? I put on them actually day by day, it’s form of like my outfit, it must be like a uniform. And I do know every day, I’m carrying yoga pants, some shirt that’s actually snug, and my hair is in a extremely messy bun, I acquired numerous hair, so this all goes up in a bun. So we checked out about 32 of them, we discovered 25% of these yoga pants had detectable fluorine within the crotch. Now, once I first began testing them, I used to be testing the knees, you’re not going to search out it within the knees. How do I do know? I examined to search out it. After which I assumed to myself, the place would I put it? And so I had the lab repeat a few them with the crotch, bam, that’s the place it was. So about 25%. Now, not one of the natural manufacturers, in case you look in…not one of the natural manufacturers that we had examined, yeah, all of them had non-detect at 10 elements per million, so that’s protected.


We did a like a not our favourite, higher, and finest class of these 32. Those that we discovered detectable there within the prime of the what we’d not advocate, then there have been ones within the center, which have been artificial supplies so we didn’t discover something in them. So be happy to purchase them. After which for these of you who need the natural model that’s in the most effective on the very backside. Yeah, so we tried to form of divide it in three for everybody to have the ability to determine that out as effectively. So this was not as dangerous, however you’ll discover it within the crotch, which might be…it could be related in different pants too if you consider it, prefer it’s going to be within the crotch. Now, I don’t know is the reply to that. I could sooner or later, perhaps begin testing underwear and swimsuits and stuff like that, however in case you…to find out about that, I don’t find out about these but as a result of I’ve been requested that query. So I’m simply going to inform you I don’t find out about some fits and underwear but. However interval underwear, I do know.


Katie: Properly, that’s encouraging that there are these good choices accessible as a result of I used to be not going to be prepared to surrender my yoga pants. However that does result in different athletic put on. So let’s speak about sports activities bras after which, because you talked about it, additionally interval underwear.


Leah: Yeah, so sports activities bras are fairly problematic. We discovered…so your sports activities bra, there’s just like the outer a part of it after which there’s the interior half. So the interior half is that, like, form of pores and skin coloration mesh that’s subsequent to your bra, which can be subsequent to your breast. We discovered detections in 65% of sports activities bras in that mesh space. And once I informed my advisors about this, numerous them they have been pediatricians that have been, , serving to me evaluation this one particular one, they have been involved and extra of our advisors have been involved as a result of that is the mesh that’s proper up towards your breasts. Now, right here’s the state of affairs I’m considering of as a result of this was my life and nonetheless might be my life. You realize, you’re a brand new mother, proper, and your child goes down for a nap, and so what do you do? You run off and also you do a exercise or one thing like that as finest as you’ll be able to and you’ve acquired like 40 minutes to an hour, proper? So that you’re understanding, understanding, after which sweating up a storm and you bought your sports activities bra on after which, you hear the noise, proper, and also you’re like, “Shoot,” didn’t get the time, so that you didn’t have time for a bathe. So you then run upstairs, you go get the infant, and growth, breastfeed. That’s the state of affairs I’m frightened about.


So in case you are a breastfeeding mom, please watch out and take a look at my investigation for the not our favourite, higher, and finest. We discovered them in 65% of those merchandise, it was not the whole lot. It was laborious due to the high-impact bras, there weren’t as many good high-impact bras, however one among them that I did discover that I believe individuals are going to be enthusiastic about is Goal. Goal has really been doing numerous work on PFAS and textiles and you may inform as a result of once I examined towards that, they got here out clear. So in case you’re a giant busted girl, which I’m, my women are fairly giant…Should you’re a giant busted girl you don’t need, like, black eyes whilst you’re understanding, proper, Goal’s a kind of manufacturers. It’s not natural, clearly, it’s stuffed with artificial polyester and yada, yada, yada, however we didn’t discover detectable PFAS within the sports activities bras there. In order that they’re known as All In Movement or one thing like that, in order that was good. And generally I simply preserve testing till I discover one thing that I can put on, , and that was a kind of points the place I simply saved testing. That was sports activities bras. In order that’s one you wish to look on Should you go there, we’ve acquired the entire exams listed proper there on all of the manufacturers that we discovered.


Katie: What about interval underwear? That is once I personally don’t have any expertise with as a result of I’m a giant fan of the menstrual cup as an alternative for the sustainability, which I do know interval underwear are as effectively, however what did you discover when it got here to those?

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Leah: It was fairly dangerous really once we regarded into interval underwear, we had…I’m attempting to recollect what number of we examined, it was over 20. I believe we solely discovered six manufacturers with out detectable ranges. Yeah, solely six, and the toughest half the place there are some manufacturers that really market themselves as PFAS-free. I’m not gonna say which model it’s however it’s your decision to have the ability to determine that out, you’ll go on their web site, and they’re going to present you scientific testing on how they will show that they’re PFAS-free. However it’s a must to have my eyes to know what you’re . You take a look at that scientific research, proper, that they despatched off to the lab, the detection degree is loads increased than mine. So I check at 10 elements per million. They have been testing at 50, so what I imply, like, I can’t make any statements about that. However I’d say there’s some humorous enterprise occurring in that.


And the issue is…I, , interviewed numerous the CEOs that had the safer interval underwear. And primarily what’s occurring is what they stated to me is you could have lots of people on this business that don’t actually have numerous expertise with textiles. Like, they don’t know loads about what they’re doing. They’re nice entrepreneurs, they’re nice, at numerous different issues, however they don’t actually know loads in regards to the processing of textiles. And in case you don’t know, you don’t know what to say, you don’t know what to ask, after which she was additionally telling me that, she’s like, you will get Oeko-Tex cloth, so to talk, and ship it to the producer, after which the producer can be like, “Oh, would you like waterproofing on that?” They usually know that in case you put that on it destroys the whole lot, like all of the accreditations and all that stuff, however they provide it in any case. And so , in case you’re somebody who doesn’t perceive the textile business, chances are you’ll fall into that class.


So what I discovered in interval underwear wasn’t ranges that regarded like…there was just a few manufacturers that had ranges that have been actually excessive, proper, I’d be like, “Whoa.” However then there have been different manufacturers that had ranges that have been low. And so while you take a look at that, it seems to be like extra of a contamination problem than it seems to be like an deliberately added problem. However I don’t know what, , the distinction is when it’s proper up by your vagina. I simply don’t know, and no one is aware of. In order that’s why we have been capable of do the classes we have been and I imagine it was…it could be seven now as a result of we preserve testing. And we preserve including to that report, , each time we do discover one thing, and those who ship me interval underwear need me to check it, simply if you wish to do this I can check stuff, simply preserve it in its authentic packaging. I simply don’t need you contaminating it. However yeah, we’ve had group members purchase extra interval underwear that they need, they ship it off to me after which we simply go check it within the lab simply to ensure we all know out of all of the manufacturers that we are able to see. That’s not one.


Katie: Gotcha. I’ll ensure that we hyperlink to those as effectively as a result of I do know you’ve written about all of those and other people can go search for the precise particulars. So for you guys listening, may have all these hyperlinks. One other related one for mothers, what about ketchup? As a result of I do know for lots of children, this can be a favourite so as to add to numerous stuff. So what about ketchup?


Leah: Ketchup was simply heartbreaking. Ketchup, the overwhelming majority of the ketchups that I examined, all had whole fluorine in it. Now, I wished to elucidate to all people that I did whole fluorine exams on the overwhelming majority of those ketchup manufacturers. I didn’t do natural fluorine, however let me inform you form of what I’ve been doing. I’ve despatched about 350 issues off to the lab during the last 2 years, numerous testing. So that provides you an concept of how a lot testing I’ve performed. And I’d say 80% of that testing, we’ve performed natural fluorine on. And once I first began, I did whole fluorine. So I wasn’t as savvy as I’m now to know in regards to the distinction between the pure fluorine and the natural fluorine, which is artificial, and also you wanted to separate that. And so, , my scientific advisors got here in and helped me with that after which we began, so ketchup is an older one.


However we discovered a ton of whole fluorine in ketchup, besides for 2 manufacturers. We didn’t discover it in Heinz, and that shocked me. So I used to be like, right here’s the common Heinz within the glass bottle, nothing, within the plastic bottle, nothing, within the little ketchup packets, nothing. We didn’t discover it, , in any Heinz product. After which we didn’t discover it in 365 Complete Meals Natural Ketchup. So it made me suppose that that could be white-labeled, perhaps white-labeled Heinz ketchup, have you learnt what I’m saying? However then each different ketchup that we examined, we discovered detectable ranges, and numerous them have been actually near 10. So it was like they have been proper there, proper?


So right here’s the reply to that, of the entire issues that I’ve despatched off to the lab, they’ve been in a position…they usually do whole fluorine on the whole lot, however then we run one other check and it’s a check for fluoride, proper? And what they do is that they search for fluoride after which they’re capable of do a calculation to deduct the whole fluorine quantity from the fluoride quantity, and that’s natural fluorine, so that they do this calculation for you. I’ve by no means seen, not doable, however I’ve simply by no means seen fluoride, greater than two, perhaps three elements per million. You realize, so numerous manufacturers will wish to say, in the event that they wish to say it’s whole fluorine, I’ve not discovered that, , fluoride to be a giant factor and something, , I believe they wish to suppose that it’s however it’s within the stuff that I’ve examined, we’ve not. I did ship two of these manufacturers as a result of two manufacturers individuals have been actually, actually…they actually wished to find out about.


And that was Primal and Annie’s. And I despatched Annie’s and Primal out for natural fluorine testing after we put this up, they usually have been just about the identical quantity. So I believe that we’re discovering numerous indications. That’s the one the place I’ve to say learn it, however perceive the testing isn’t full. And I do plan on updating that individual investigation, including extra manufacturers, and doing the entire shebang, it’s simply most likely not going to be till subsequent yr someday, proper? And I wish to give these manufacturers a while to work on it. So I do know numerous them do find out about my testing and whether or not…I don’t know in the event that they’re making any strikes, as a result of they haven’t come to me and stated they’re making any strikes. In order that’s unlucky, however I’ll say in different manufacturers…or different industries, there’s manufacturers making some fairly hefty strikes right here.


Katie: So, to be continued, and I’ll put hyperlinks to the present ones so individuals can have these as a place to begin. And I do know that there’s extra to come back in different classes as effectively. So individuals can keep updated with you to maintain a watch out for that. It additionally makes me curious if it’s doable to get individuals examined for these compounds. And I additionally surprise like, is there even a…in case you’re going to weigh the danger and advantages, is it even price doing? We don’t know learn how to get them out of the physique and we all know it’s good to keep away from them. Like, is it price testing if it’s even doable? Or is it higher simply to know they’re dangerous and keep away from them?


Leah: So I want I’d have performed that once I didn’t end that query for you. I’ve a check downstairs, there’s a model new check that got here out. I believe it’s known as Empower FX. So I’m going to should double verify on that. However there’s a model new check the place you’ll be able to prick your finger and ship it to a lab. Now, this can be a massive big deal as a result of it’s not costly and it’s accessible to all people. So let me offer you some background. So I wished to do a physique burden, , scientific research. And I had numerous scientists concerned and we form of talked about it. And what we realized was, it was near inconceivable to do that as a result of your physique doesn’t launch it. So, , it’s not like with polyphenols and, , you wait per week later and also you simply don’t eat them or put them into your physique, they’ll be much less. That’s not the case of PFAS. So it’s actually laborious to check in your physique, actually, actually tough to do these comparisons, so we ended up not doing it.


At that time, we have been trying right into a lab that was about $1,000 a check. Oh, yeah, loopy. So I’ll inform you my pleasure when I discovered a model who’s doing this for $250. And also you’re doing it at house. What we have been going to look into was sending individuals to a draw lab after which sending it off to a lab in Canada. And prefer it was all of this, , strategic, loopy stuff that we needed to do. However now there’s a firm, and I wish to say Empower FX, and we’ll hyperlink that down beneath. However they partnered with Eurofins and Eurofins is a humongous $6 billion lab all over the world. So it’s a extremely…that’s an ideal partnership. And so Eurofins is the associate on this they usually’re producing these little check kits. So you’ll be able to check your self, it’s somewhat drip of blood, ship it off, and I imagine they’re testing for between 16 to 30 completely different PFAS, however the most typical ones that you simply’re going to search out in water.


Katie: Good to know, I’ll put hyperlinks to that as effectively if it’s in your website, or I’ll get that information from you for people who find themselves…


Leah: It’s not but.


Katie: Okay.


Leah: You’ve acquired it first.


Katie: How thrilling. And as I anticipated, our time, after all, flew by as a result of we all the time have such enjoyable conversations.


Leah: How has it been 45 minutes? Oh my gosh.


Katie: So we’ll simply should do extra rounds of this as an increasing number of investigations come out. However simply on the finish, I like to ask if there’s any parting recommendation you wish to give to our listeners right this moment, may very well be associated to this or one thing completely unrelated to all of the mothers listening?


Leah: Oh, , by way of these items, I’d say don’t sweat the small stuff, proper? I imply, I’ve been doing toxic-free for seven years now, perhaps eight. And that’s one of many issues that I’ve realized, , I wish to know what absolutely the worst issues are and I’ll keep away from these. And the entire different issues, I’ll based mostly on my emotional wants at that second, proper? And so, by way of like, while you’re serious about issues, don’t freak out about one thing you employ as soon as a month, proper? What you wish to take a look at are the large dailies, proper, every day exposures. So don’t sweat the small stuff by way of, , don’t freak out over some factor that you simply’re going to be consuming, , or consuming as soon as a month. So go off to your good friend’s home, eat the pizza, and drink, and the cake and, , take pleasure in your self. As a result of the stress that you could placed on individuals based mostly on being afraid of all these items, I believe, could be worse on you total than I believe the precise chemical substances themselves and that’s what I’ve realized through the years.


And so shield your house, shield your soul, so to talk, from being too afraid. I believe that there’s a distinction between having a wholesome worry of one thing that’s harmful, what I’m saying, and avoiding that since you’re good. And in addition stepping into the world of it’d being like a disordered considering course of, , the disordered considering means of the whole lot is poisonous just isn’t place so that you can be. I need you to take pleasure in your life. And , comply with individuals like Katie and I for, , directions on what to do after which simply let it go. You realize, that’s my recommendation is, , management what you bought within the house, exit and discover the world and luxuriate in your self, and check out to not let your craziness sink into different locations is my finest recommendation.


After which simply, , attempt to keep abreast of this, however , that is a kind of points the place individuals are probably not contacting their elected officers about this. And I do know there’s lots of people particularly in like Republican districts and stuff like that, they’re not listening to sufficient from you, as a result of they’d be doing extra in the event that they heard from you. And I actually really feel like for lots of girls who’re residing in Republic, congressional districts and stuff like that, name them, allow them to know you’re involved about this. Allow them to know that you simply care, and also you care about them, have you learnt what I’m saying? Should you’re voting for them, and that is your problem, make it possible for they know that that is necessary to them. As a result of I used to work for elected officers a few years in the past and I’ll say that when the ladies begin calling up, and after they begin pushing and honking on the doorways, they acquired their little strollers and stuff, you’re in bother. It’s the senior residents and the mothers and also you don’t wish to piss off both of these teams. However , that is simply one thing that your elected officers want to listen to extra from you on as a result of there’s numerous states and once I say loads, I imply numerous states proper now which can be contemplating like 200 items of laws on PFAS. They should hear from you.


Katie: Yeah, I’ve stated that so many occasions on this podcast that mothers are such a pressure of nature and that widespread coverage occurs when the common mother modifications her thoughts and will get concerned and that’s on so many various ranges. And I’ve seen it on a neighborhood degree. Truly, the place I used to dwell, it was attention-grabbing, on this state, homebirth was technically not authorized for some time, and a bunch of mothers I do know lobbied and acquired it modified. However I believe it doesn’t should be…I believe we regularly don’t do it as a result of we expect it must be this big quantity, this big groundswell, it really doesn’t as a result of I additionally used to web page for representatives and it doesn’t take that many calls and letters earlier than they listen. So I’d say don’t underestimate…particularly on stuff like this that pertains to our children, don’t underestimate your energy to alter that. And in addition to echo your different recommendation, be careful for what you’ll be able to but in addition notice the physique is good and adaptable and designed to heal and keep away from the worst of the worst, however don’t let it rule your life or turn into aggravating. And that applies to meals, that applies to what we work together with in our every day lives, and provides your self some grace on the finish of the day too.


Leah: Love you, woman. You’re so nice at summarizing my level.


Katie: Proper again at you, and thanks for the time right this moment. It’s all the time, after all, so enjoyable to get to talk with you. Like I stated, we’ll do it once more as an increasing number of information turns into accessible. However thanks for being right here.


Leah: In fact. It’s my pleasure. Thanks for having me, Katie.


Katie: And thanks, as all the time, to all of you for listening and sharing your Most worthy assets, your time, your vitality and your consideration with us right this moment. We’re each so grateful that you simply did and I hope that you’ll be part of me once more on the subsequent episode of “The Wellness Mama Podcast.”


Should you’re having fun with these interviews, would you please take two minutes to depart a score or evaluation on iTunes for me? Doing this helps extra individuals to search out the podcast, which implies much more mothers and households may gain advantage from the knowledge. I actually admire your time, and thanks as all the time for listening.

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